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#96642 - 04/21/05 01:00 AM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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King Les Offline
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Good to see you Michael.

#96643 - 04/21/05 02:56 AM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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Ron Pack Offline
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Tex and Michael

Yes... the male attacked the female several months earlier injuring her left leg. He then went for her upper beak but wasn't able to get a good hold, but he did manage to leave a scuff mark on her beak and a small nick to her nare. The two were separated right then and there.

Again...the video isn't of an attack.... I feel the male was reacting to a situation that he felt was dangerous. So, I'm not sure if this was just an extreme version of a warning... or a normal warning for these types of birds... or an act of abuse on his part. To me it was abuse, but thats only because I saw this thru my eyes and not theirs...

I suppose the most confusing thing to me is how the female shows no fear of him whatsoever... confused

#96644 - 04/21/05 04:34 AM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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Quote:
posted April 20, 2005 04:12 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Field biologists and most of the academically-educated parrot behaviorists have actually for the most part discarded this idea of the altruistic act of biting one's mate to get it out of danger and instead called it displaced aggression. The bird cannot reach what it is intending to strike at, so it lashes out at the closest thing. Parrots, as we know, are selfish creatures so they would rather save themselves first, even before its mate, and though they mourn the passing of a long-term partner, they are quick to pair up with another one in the wild. Similarly, the idea of biting one's own mate has no survival-oriented significance.

Have you ever seen a goose rip at grass when it feels threatened by an approaching human or dog? Similar idea.

Though relatively little actual fact is known about the habits of Indonesian cockatoos, other than what the trappers of these birds know because they base the well-being of their families off of knowledge of wild cockatoo behavior. However, from what I understand, no one has ever reported sightings or the effects of physical abuse among the members of a cockatoo pair in the wild. My personal thought is that mate abuse is a byproduct of captivity because they are living in an unnaturally limited amount of space and clipped and therefore not allowed to move in the way nature bestowed them.

Thank you so much for sharing your video, Ron. Are they not allowed to be together because he will beat her up or because they will lay eggs?

Thanks for answering my question.
The thing I saw strange about the video is tht they were just sitting there. Hardly no interaction and like someone said WHAM!
With my Macaw, I was holding him and the cable guy came in (bald-headed) and Wham! he got me good. No squawk warning like normal.
Also my Cockatoo who was on the back of an out door chair I was sitting in and for no reason tht I knew of he tried to tag my face.
I always believed as someone else said tht it was a protective thing. But am beginnig to wonder if it is for their own self-reasoning. As much as I would like to believe they are trying to protect me I find this untrue. I know chickens are not the same but have you ever seen them in the wild? I have seen some of the same behaviors. And they have definate space/boundaries issues. For 6 years I sat in a cage everyday and watched them interact etc.

#96645 - 04/21/05 05:30 PM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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Relle Offline
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I wish they could say exactly why they do things...would make life soooo much easier frown
Looks like I'm going to have to do some more reading.

#96646 - 04/21/05 05:47 PM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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scoutkj Offline
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Well, anthropomorphism is a pretty hot topic. Sometimes it's better to know the what instead of the why , in my opinion.

#96647 - 04/21/05 06:20 PM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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Scoutkj

I completely agree. I think it would be far more productive of us -- not to mention beneficial for our birds -- if we stopped treating them like humans and acting like we know what they are thinking and started listening to them as if trying to understand a foreign language without a dictionary. We can learn the definitions to each individual bird's language if we look at what happens immediately before and after the given behavior.

Not that Ron wasn't completely right to be completely befuddled by the female's behavior. Just one more way that makes the human-parrot coexistence a mystery that it has lasted this long.

tex

#96648 - 04/21/05 09:14 PM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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Relle Offline
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Although I consider myself fairly well-read I have no idea what "anthropomorphism" is. Explanation please?

#96649 - 04/21/05 11:11 PM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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scoutkj Offline
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It basically means to project humanity into something that is not human. In this case we're talking about birds, but it could be a plant, a robot, whatever (so long as it isn't human). It means that when the bird looks at us a certain way or does something, we view it and interpret it in strictly human terms (as though they respond to us as humans and not as birds).

#96650 - 04/21/05 11:24 PM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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Julz Offline
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Anthropomorphism... attribution of human qualities to nonhumans. People attribute human qualities to toys, products, and machines, and they design toys, products, and machines.....

FROM WEBSTERS

#96651 - 04/22/05 05:44 PM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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Relle Offline
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Thank you for the explanation smile I know for sure I do that all the time with my birdies...I'll "talk for them" to my bf, like Cricket will try to get his attention and I"ll be like she's saying, "Daddy, scritch me, please!" Hmmm, now that I think about it, it does seem rather stupid to assume that that is what she is thinking...

#96652 - 04/22/05 07:10 PM Re: Abuse caught on tape  
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Well, I do the same thing... I just recognize when it's critical that I not do it and when I can allow myself to feel those things without consequence.
I mean, we really could talk forever about what was he thinking and when did he know it, but seriously, we can just look at behavior and consequence and get from step A to step B in training much more quickly, you know?
smile

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