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#220776 - 05/14/10 04:59 AM First Real Bite - Fractured finger.  
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LoveTheLola Offline
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Although I don't have any pictures (as if I could stomach seeing it again anyways), I received my first real bite a little over 2 months ago from Lola (Lolo).

He was being Cranky, and wanted to be hyper when I was getting ready for work. After breaking my necklace, and while I was taking him back to his cage for a small time out, he decided to tell me his displeasure in this by flipping around on my hand and grabbing into my pinky at the base.

After carefully getting him free from my hand, trying to keep calm in the process, I was free to inspect the damage. Which gave me the heebie Geebies and a bit of the spins doing so till it was cleaned up. The lower mandible left two puncture wounds on each side of the back (palm side) of the little finger facing towards the tip, while the upper mandible managed to sink into the side of the ring finger. My pinky was crunched between. God did it hurt like hell, but I fixed it up and went to work anyways. They sent me home early after finding I couldn't grasp anything tightly with that hand. So I went to the ER as a failsafe and found that I had a hairline fracture below the first knuckle, and that the muscle was slightly torn. So they gave me a tetanus shot to be careful, and a broad spectrum antibiotic since puncture wounds are at a higher risk for infection, before taping my hand together.

It still hurts on occation if I try to grip anything heavy in that hand. It serves as a reminder that they can do damage, without even really trying, and that caution needs to be taken. Since the incident, I've been trying to clicker train Lola, and have been working on calming him when he get's overly stimulated before we handle him.

So many people tell me that they would just "get rid of the bird" after it happened. I ask them if their child bit them, or did something to cause pain, would they just ship them off or give them up for adoption? That just because the bite happened, it doesn't mean I love Lola any less because he's like my child. I finish by telling them that those thoughts and attitudes about getting rid of a bity bird, is the reason so many are in rescue centers now.

Yeah, the bites hurt, but maybe by us being understanding and compassionate others will learn by example that it isn't a reason to turn the tail under and give up.


I pitty those who are locked in their mind, never openning it to the truth.
#220777 - 05/14/10 05:07 AM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: LoveTheLola]  
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Janny Offline
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OUCH LTL!!!!! thanks for sharing...I am glad you didn't give up.As much as the bites hurt both emotionally and physically I agree it isn't worth sending them off somewhere.


Jan

Sometimes damaged goods are the best gifts the world has to offer
#220792 - 05/14/10 04:32 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: LoveTheLola]  
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Yikes! I got the same thing this weekend when I was at the ER when my Tootsie bit me badly. They look at you like you're crazy, and ask why the bird did it, and when you can't give them a good answer they look at you even crazier.

To that, I say this -- screw 'em. (Although it's taken me a few days of healing to get there.)

Last edited by jamienlarry; 05/14/10 04:34 PM.

Jamie, Tootsie's mom
#220801 - 05/14/10 07:32 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: LoveTheLola]  
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Originally Posted By: LoveTheLola
So many people tell me that they would just "get rid of the bird" after it happened. I ask them if their child bit them, or did something to cause pain, would they just ship them off or give them up for adoption?


I give you an enormous amount of credit...I have never been bit that hard with what appears to have been malice...when my Birds act irratically and/or bite I try not to take it personally but I have a hard time trusting them again...

Good luck and I hope the clicker works for you...I am thinking about trying it...

#220807 - 05/14/10 09:43 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: GregM]  
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Trust me Greg, once you get bit this hard, you'll never sweat it again, because you know it's probably the worst they'll ever get you. Yeah, it hurts like hell, but you don't fear a bad bite anymore.

As for not trusting them, it is good to always be cautious. It is when we forget and let ourselves slip and get too comfortable that they remind us that they can do damage. As long as you keep taking precautions, you'll be ok.

The clicker training is helping, and seems to pull him out of his tantrums quicker. At least so far.

Again, when he bit me, I probably should have had him on a stick, because he was so over stimulated and just out of his mind crazy. I didn't take the proper precautions when he was in that state at the time, and suffered for my mistake. He was only acting as a bird will when worked up.


I pitty those who are locked in their mind, never openning it to the truth.
#220811 - 05/14/10 10:58 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: LoveTheLola]  
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Been there unfortunately! One of my M2's fractured my thumb a couple of years ago. In the Bite forum is a picture of my hand all wrapped up.


Birds are angels who lift us up when our own wings forget how to fly.

"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has!" ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~

Noelle, A Rehabilitation in Progress
#220875 - 05/16/10 05:27 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: EchosMom]  
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So sorry to hear about the bite LTL! I commend you on your attitude about bites, they can and will happen.

I have been bitten but nothing broken thank goodness. Only once has Ozzy broke the skin on me, and that was a fly by ear biting (he pierced my ear...could have put a new earring in the hole lol). I have also been bitten in the past, from some of my parents parrots, probably should have had stitches a couple of times. Bites are just part of having these companions share our lives.

Hubby plays tug-o-war, and rougher games with Ozzy than I will. He has been accidentally nabbed many times, however he never gets upset with Ozzy or blames him for it. He knows full well that any rough housing can result in a bite. He adores Ozzy and calls him his RottaToo lol. He was also the first one to get Ozzy to allow his harness to be put on, and the first one Ozzy showered with. So obviously there is a great deal of trust and love between the two.

We are both very aware of Ozzy's body language, and watch for signs constantly. Ozzy is usually very gentle with both of us, and if he starts getting a little rambunctious, we can say "be easy" and he usually settles down.


Deborah
A Too is not a pet, it is a choice for life!


#220917 - 05/17/10 08:53 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: FeatheredAngels]  
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my first bite with angelina happened almost the same way. I knew she was worked up and angry about something, but because she had never bitten me, I got a little too over confident. I make sure now to wait till she cools down before I step her up or ask her to do something. Sorry about your bite, I know they hurt like heck

#221120 - 05/22/10 06:56 AM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: angelinasmom]  
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I'm sitting here trying to type left handed as my right hand is in a brace from a bite. We took in Rocky in Feb. At the time 'he' was Roxy. At that time he bite my finger and fractured the tip. He was a pluckier and the history of biting me is on going. I have a long story needing telling elsewhere. The bottom line is this time he bite, got the beck in and wouldn't let go just keep grinding. I finally got the beck pulled out, can't believe I stayed calm. I wasn't going to go to get it looked at but, the pharmacist said an infection was already present 30 minutes later. I had a red raised rash and needed to go to emergency.
I got a shot for tetanus and antibiotic. Got put on two antibiotics and told to see doc in am. She says the bite is ground hamburger. Can't put in stitches but braced the arm so I can't bend wrist. I have to wear the brace until the scare tissue fills in. When I asked if the center was going to sluph off she said "it will be scared and it will be very ugly."
My daughter says he needs to be put down. My dh says he needs to be punished. I need to find more info. I'm doing searches here to get all the info I can on biting behavior and how I need to handle this different.


My flock: Stewy-Tiel, Sky-B&G, Newton, Ping & Pong-OWA's,Don Juan-YNA, Cody & Rocky-U2's, Merlin-M2
#221123 - 05/22/10 11:28 AM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: pineview01]  
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Pineview, you should make a thread in the ABA forum, I think EM and Bev could help you out a lot there.

Putting your bird down is too extreme and punishment will get you nowhere. I hope you can figure things out, ongoing serious bites are no fun and really hard to deal with.

#221126 - 05/22/10 01:21 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: Cidsa]  
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Pineview I'm sorry you got such a bad bite but Cidsa has given you excellent advice. EM and Bev can definatly give you excellent advise in the ABA forum and help you develop a plan to work with Roxy. Euthanasia should never be considered for behavioral reasons. If in the end you decide that you can not come to grips with Roxy's behavior there are sanctuaries out there that can help to find him a new home.
Nancy


Nancy & Cassie BE2
#221128 - 05/22/10 01:41 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: BE2Cassie]  
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I agree 100% with Nancy!!!
Perhaps Cockatoo rescue is an option for Roxy if you try understanding and working with the behavior without success. Punishing a bird is just abuse. It will never work.
Hope you heal well and fast!
Tania


Flock is Nina (U2), Tootsie (U2), Baby (LSC), Ruke (TAG),& Birdie (T2),
#221137 - 05/22/10 05:40 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: Rukesmom]  
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IMHO to have a bird put down because of biting is unethical.There are other options and I believe you need to look at them....whether it be working things out in ABA or a rescue facility or sanctuary there are better options than euthenizing for aggression.I would seriously reconsider that choice.


Jan

Sometimes damaged goods are the best gifts the world has to offer
#221140 - 05/22/10 06:56 PM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: Janny]  
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Pineview,

I, too, hope that you will start a thread in the ABA forum for more specific help from Bev and EM. In the meantime, I agree with what the others have said above.

I live with a severe macaw (also named Rocky!) who would bite me every day if he could, especially in the beginning of our relationship (we have made significant progress over the past 3+ years). The reason he doesn't? I don't give him the opportunity!

You don't want to get bit, not only for the obvious pain reason, but also because every time Rocky bites, he hones his skills and becomes a better biter.

Were you handling him when the biting happened? How did he have access to you? In our case, I stick trained our macaw, so that I can transport him and protect myself (if he comes over to attack, I just have him step up on a stick -- I always have a stick with me). My husband handles him, but our relationship is more hands-off.

I'd recommend being really observant, perhaps even creating a bite journal, where you write down everything you can think of that might have contributed to the bites. For example, my macaw will attack my husband, his favorite person, if he wears certain clothes. My parents had a quaker that would bite only after eating refined sugar, so they modified his diet. I have a caique that will fly over and attack if we read magazines on the couch, so now we only read them upstairs. Sometimes it's really silly (to us) stuff that provokes a bite.

Parrots generally are quite expressive with their body language. Was Rocky sending you signals he was getting agitated/too excited/about to bite and you either didn't recognize them or disregarded them? I truly believe that most parrots don't want to bite, but resort to biting out of frustration when their other methods of communication have failed. After all, it gets results!

One great way at becoming more fluent in your parrot's body language is by clicker training. http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/Bird-Click/ is a link to a free yahoo group where you can learn how.

Good luck to you, and I hope you heal quickly and with less scarring than you're planning on having. Please stick around and we can help you with this.

#221205 - 05/25/10 12:45 AM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: Beeps]  
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I"m not sure if I'm suppose to respond here or not. This isn't my thread and I didn't want to hyjack it. But you all have good ? and comments.


My flock: Stewy-Tiel, Sky-B&G, Newton, Ping & Pong-OWA's,Don Juan-YNA, Cody & Rocky-U2's, Merlin-M2
#221209 - 05/25/10 02:41 AM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: pineview01]  
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You are welcome to respond to any thread except those in the Applied Behavior Analysis forum. Those are reserved for one-on-one help with the ABA Moderators! smile

#221210 - 05/25/10 03:51 AM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: Charlie]  
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Originally Posted By: Charlie
You are welcome to respond to any thread!


With the exception of the threads in the Applied Behavior Case Studies forum where someone is receiving individual help from Bev. smile
(Unless of course it's your ABA thread.) I also agree that euthanizing nor punishment are the answers to biting, or any other behavior problems.

Last edited by EchosMom; 05/25/10 03:56 AM. Reason: added

Birds are angels who lift us up when our own wings forget how to fly.

"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has!" ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~

Noelle, A Rehabilitation in Progress
#221213 - 05/25/10 04:10 AM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: EchosMom]  
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Please don't "put the bird down" because you got bit! Rocky is just being a bird! Hope you heal quickly! You haven't had him long enough to learn to read his behavior! Please keep us updated!


Gail
#221226 - 05/25/10 06:54 AM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: Bird Mom]  
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I won't be putting the bird down. That is just my oldest dd's feelings. As far as punishing, I am trying to educate my dh. It is hard to explain to him that he is wrong, when what I'm doing isn't working. He is just upset I got bite so bad. He is helping me with Rocky while we try to figure out if he just hates me. Iím not sure if I already posted this but when I first got him he bite me several times. I talked to a Too & Macaw rehaber and she said to prevent getting bite in the first place. I backed off and went a whole month without getting bite again.

He is on meds so Iím not sure how much body language Iím missing and how much is the drugs.


Originally Posted By: Beeps
Pineview,
You don't want to get bit, not only for the obvious pain reason, but also because every time Rocky bites, he hones his skills and becomes a better biter.

This is so very true.

I was stepping Rocky up to put in the cage for the night. He would use one foot and pat my arm. I would leave and come back to try agian three different times. On the fouth try, he heard my dh talking outside to the cats. His crest came up and he nailed me before I could pull back. When I tried to pull back he grabed like he has my shirt before and when you pull it from him he digs in and rips it.

Last edited by Janny; 05/25/10 06:10 PM. Reason: combined double post

My flock: Stewy-Tiel, Sky-B&G, Newton, Ping & Pong-OWA's,Don Juan-YNA, Cody & Rocky-U2's, Merlin-M2
#221228 - 05/25/10 08:01 AM Re: First Real Bite - Fractured finger. [Re: pineview01]  
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It took my wife almost two years to have a good relationship with our 'Too. They are the best of buddies now. Just protect yourself and do all the "good' things you can. I know it sounds like a long time but, with a 'Too, it isn't. It is hard to believe we have had her over ten years now.

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