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yafa
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Hello
my u2 is 10 month old (male DNA)he's name is Shugie.
I have had him for 6 month now.
he LOVES to be handfed.
i feed him twice a day.
he gets realy happy when it's time for feeding.
he does not eat on he's on at all.
i tried many diferent kind of foods.
the only things he likes is pine nuts sheld and pinuts, he like to brake them open.
I dont at all mind the handfeeding but a little worried that he will never ever eat on he's on.

what do you think ???

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yafa
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sory, Forgot to mention the amount of Shugie's feeding.
Hr gets 48 cc twice a day.
he is 480 grams.
i did read some where that parrot should be fed
10% of there body weight.

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Charlie
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We're not here to teach you how to raise and feed an Umbrella cockatoo. Ask the breeder or pet store you got him from and don't expect honest answers. Better yet, take him back and let them finish the job they should have done if they were ethical at all.

You have had this bird six months and you joined Mytoos six months ago. As far as I'm concerned, you should have known better. At this point, your vet is your best resource. Do you have one?

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Bird Mom
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Little bird is still almost a baby..you got him SO young....don't worry. Shugie will eat on his own soon [Smile] They need lots of patience & time!
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momma2darwin
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Yafa, clearly you care a lot about doing the right thing for your little Shugie. He was MUCH TOO YOUNG to have been sold to you when he was! Please take him immediately to an EXPERIENCED avian vet in your area. Read extensively, and research on other reputable sites re: abundance weaning, adequate diet for your 'toos sub species. Become an expert in knowledge for his sake and for the sake of many future years you will have together! Research also the confidence building of a bird that has been allowed to fledge in a controlled manner, also for safety! Babies this young are given over to us sometimes without any recommendations or guidance, and you have some serious learning to do! [Eek!] [Eek!] Best wishes and please hang in there!! You will do just fine because you have such a love for your young adoptee! [Smile]
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happybirds
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Yafa - Ollie (who is now 11y/o) was only 4 months old when I got him (first bird/stupid mistakes) Anyway, he was fully a year old when he was TOTALLY weaned. I used the Bountiful Weaning method on him, and he now eats almost anything I offer to him. Weaning a bird is difficult as they tend to lose weight during that process and have to be monitored (weighing ) closely. You do have to get him weaned as you don't want him to only expect handfeeding for life - especially since hand feeding formula is fortified and is designed for young birds. I can't stress enough that you have to get him weaned. I think I would start slowly decreasing the amount of handfeeding formula and offering soft warm foods to help fill him up. Try sweet potatoes - they are soft and warm, and the birds love them - just make sure if you nuke them, you MAKE CERTAIN there are no hot spots as crops can easily be burned and that can lead to infection and death. Mooshed up bananas are also usually eaten. Remember, you are going from basically a liquid diet, to food with substance. Pellets with a little fruit juice to soften them may also be eaten. Just like a real baby, goes from milk, to semi-liquid foods, to food with substance, to real food. If you don't think you can wean him out yourself, get in touch with your vet for assistance. Leave pellets in the cage all day also.

I would not take him back to the breeder. Just my personal opinion, preferring to take care of my bird myself.

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Eefjuh
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[Confused]

Where did my reply go????

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Jerry
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Your reply was completely incorrect so we deleted it. You said:

"Normally a cockatoo is weaned by 12 to 16 weeks!"

You cant come here and just post generalized information like that because one size doesnt fit all.

A Moluccan cockatoo for instance can take as long as 6 to 9 months or so to be properly weaned.

The smaller 'Toos take less, but even a U2 should take 4 to 7 MONTHS depending.

The main issue as I see it with this 10 month old bird is that the owner is killing him with kindness and should WEAN the bird! It's very important not to wean too early, but it's also important not to wean too long. This can cause just as many problems as fast forced weaning because the bird needs to learn to be independent just like a child. This is why "some" breeders turn their birds over to others to wean... because they often wont wean for "mommy"... the person that's been feeding them all along. Do you think the bird's just going to up and quit accepting food from you? NO!

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Janny
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I think you need to go to an Avian Vet to get correct methods of weaning a cockatoo.You can get some good info on it here but there will also be bad info.The vet is going give you propper procedure.You will need to follow weight gain and loss etc.

Jan

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Kim & Lilly
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The bird should be supplied with a variety of foods ranging from fruit and vegetable tidbits to pellets that should be available all the time, the bird is continued to be hand fed. A properly weaned bird learns to trust humans through the actions of it's caregiver. It gains self-confidence, learns to accept different foods readily and is comfortable in a changing environment. While initially "Abundance Weaning" is exclusively needed for nutrition, eventually it turns into the need for emotional comfort. The word "weaning" in this context implies an awareness of the bird’s needs. It goes beyond the mere satisfaction of nutritional requirements. "Weaning" implies love, caring, emotional support and the application of simple, elementary rules. It implies knowledge of the early very distinctive stages in their maturation and the birds’ individual changing and very specific behavioral patterns.
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umbietoo
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our 'too was weaned very late by her first owner (we've had her for 9 years and she's 11). her owner liked having lucy "need her" which is so selfish and wrong. fortunately lucy is okay but it could have been a disaster. you are not in a good situation right now. please don't take it lightly. get educated quickly for your 'toos sake! thank you for coming to get help...
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happybirds
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Kim, sorry, I'm a bit confused by what you wrote, and would ask that you expand your statement for me.

quote:
While initially "Abundance Weaning" is exclusively needed for nutrition, eventually it turns into the need for emotional comfort
Are you saying that using abundance weaning itself causes the need for emotional comfort?
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Janie
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I understand the anxiety you might feel about what you are doing. Take the advice offered here, and go forward the best you can. I wish I had discovered this site a year ago. Our U2 was not weaned properly, and it will take her a long time to get her used to proper foods. Read everything on this site, and get that little bundle of joy and frustration to a bird vet. They will be able to check the mouth and make sure they aren't vitamin deprived, and perhaps do blood tests that will make sure there are no diseases that you could catch.
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Kim & Lilly
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HB - Sorry did not mean to confuse. I took an exert from an article. I was just not sure I wanted to post the whole thing.

Abundant Weaning

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Eefjuh
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@ Jerry

I DIDN'T tell him to waen the baby himself! You might read better, because I for 100% certainly know that I wrote that he EMEDIATELY should go OR to his breeder OR to a avian vet!

That my post about 12 tot 16 weeks was inapropriate, was that I forgot to say that KERA mu U2 (and just like other U2's here in holland) should be weaned at about 12 tot 16 weeks, but you CAN have diffirent cases of baby's that just won't waen that soon.

Don't like that you just erase my post, and not just give a reply that I was wrong. We can still ALL learn about it, an instead of giving me a direct straight answer, you'll just delete my post! Isn't a messageboard to learn from or what??

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couragee
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Let's not forget who owns, operates and provides this lovely and needed educational board. Let's also not forget the board mission statement. To even be discussing weaning techniques here goes against the purpose of the board. If someone has a weaning question, the minimum response is see a qualified avian vet. PERIOD. And as for Jerry. This board is his to edit as he sees fit. We all agreed to that when we became members. Have a problem. Well it's yours, not Jerry's. PERIOD.

The bird needs to be evaluated by a vet. Person selling such a young bird needs to be punished. PERIOD.

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happybirds
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Couragee - I certainly hope it is not as cut and dry as you indicate it is. However, having been mostly reading, and occassionally posting here for several years, nothing would surprise me, however, that being said, I don't particularily picture Jerry as being as one sided as you indicate.

I know if I had read Eefjuh's post which said weaning out at 6-12 weeks, I would have screwed up my nose and said NO WAY, but after reading her second post about where she is, I do recognize that different countries do things quite differently than we do.

Eefjuh posted something that I have heard is common in other countries. Why they wean babies out that early is beyond me, but I think perhaps the folks in Holland or other countries may feel we take way too long to wean them out.

I guess the question is, are we correct or are other countries.

I do take exception to:
quote:
To even be discussing weaning techniques here goes against the purpose of the board. If someone has a weaning question, the minimum response is see a qualified avian vet
We are all aware that there are many folks, not including the poster of the original question, that don't take their birds to vets. They don't do a lot of things that they should. If someone comes here and asks a question, I am not going to answer it with "see a vet" because I don't want them going somewhere else and getting a wrong answer and having that young bird die and having it on my concious. I have always answered anyone that I feel I can give information to as best I can.

I know the mission, and I know the position. I am also against purchasing a bird but you know, it happens, and we can't close the door on someone just becuase they made a mistake.

If you poll the membership, you will find that probably the majority of us have purchased at a minimum 1 bird from a breeder, or pet store or something, until we learned better.

In ending, not trying to get your knickers in a twist, just hoping you see the bigger picture.

No bird should suffer because you or me or anyone isn't forthcoming with the best information we have available. The canned response of see a vet just isn't the answer.

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happybirds
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Kim - I'm really laughing at myself, because I am really struggling to understand what Mr. Kiesselbach is actually saying in that sentance.

Do you think he is saying that it makes them an emotional cripple, or do well, what do you think he is saying.

Has me crippled trying to figure it out.

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Kim & Lilly
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HB - Hummm...

quote:
Do you think he is saying that it makes them an emotional cripple, or do well, what do you think he is saying.


No, I do not think she is saying that.

"I" think she is saying where as initially,in the beginning, abundance weaning is only (mostly) used for the nutritional value, but as they start growing, it enables them to feel an emotional comfort and trust as well ( with the care giver), which is just as important to the birds health, because this enables them to trust to try new foods (i.e. pellets, veggies and fruits), accept changes in environment more easlity, learn self confidence, etc.

Make any sense?? Please, anyone feel free to correct me if I am wrong...I have no personal experience with this, only lots of reading.

I am done posting about it! Just doesn't feel right!

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Charlie
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Jan, I deleted the post, it was wrong.

quote:
Eefjuh posted something that I have heard is common in other countries. Why they wean babies out that early is beyond me, but I think perhaps the folks in Holland or other countries may feel we take way too long to wean them out.

I guess the question is, are we correct or are other countries.

They may feel that way; most breeders in the U.S. feel the same way. The enlightened article provided by Kim explains why they are all wrong.

quote:
We are all aware that there are many folks, not including the poster of the original question, that don't take their birds to vets. They don't do a lot of things that they should. If someone comes here and asks a question, I am not going to answer it with "see a vet" because I don't want them going somewhere else and getting a wrong answer and having that young bird die and having it on my concious.
That is probably the best answer to most questions. What do you mean, "if they go somewhere else and get a wrong answer", when seeing a vet is the right answer? I also do not want wrong information on my conscience.

quote:
If you poll the membership, you will find that probably the majority of us have purchased at a minimum 1 bird from a breeder, or pet store or something, until we learned better.
That's true but Mytoos' members that go out and buy babies, come back asking us to help them wean a bird or espousing how easy their two year old is, that is wrong and we do not have the time and space for it. We are not here to make concessions to ignorant people who do not get our agenda, even though they signed up for it. If we do that, before long, novice breeders will be showing up here saying their baby chick has a hole in it's crop and what do they do about it.

Not trying to be mean either, you are a valued member but lines must be drawn or the whole thing becomes a free for all. [Smile] One can partake of all the information without making a fool of themselves.

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couragee
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Okay, I am getting emotional here, and that is not common for me. But really people. YICKS.
quote:
Eefjuh posted something that I have heard is common in other countries. Why they wean babies out that early is beyond me, but I think perhaps the folks in Holland or other countries may feel we take way too long to wean them out.

I guess the question is, are we correct or are other countries.


No country has a right to have an opinion about whether a bird is weaned at 8, 12, 16 or 50 weeks. Think about it. Mother nature has been weaning birds for a millennium but here in dumb f*** you fill in country of your choice, we feel 12 weeks is okay. That is simply wrong. What has research, observation of natural habitates and parents, and medical science say is best for these captured creatures. I don't care what authority anyone has, 12 weeks just ain't the answer.

And I am not speaking for Jerry and am not defining this site as so black and white. I was just reacting to what I precieved as an attack on his running of his board.

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yafa
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Shugie was taken to the vet the next day after i got him.
they did run some tests and every thing was fine with him.
i do offer him hand wining food.
i will try some of the advice i got hear.

Thanks for all the replys.
YAFA

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happybirds
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Charlie - you repeated yourself. (2 posts)
I completely agree that taking the bird to the vet is always the correct answer, but as I said, not everyone does that. What I meant by going to the wrong place and getting the wrong information is that they found MyToos, and asked their question. If they don't get an answer, then they will find another board, and hopefully get the right answers, but who knows.

I personally feel that weaning a bird out over a long period of time is the correct way to do it, and it is how I weaned my Ollie out. I didn't say that I agree with weaning out as early as many breeder, or other countries wean out. But, the truth is, that is what they do. I was just making a statement, not agreeing.

I also agree with your last paragraph, I don't know if novice breeders will be coming here or not, but I just think that the information should be given. I personally try to make the time to answer the questions asked if I feel I can contribute as I think it is important to help anyone who is smart enough to ask the question. I just don't think canned answers are the answer. As for there not being enough space on MyToos to answer those sorts of questions, I never really gave that any thought.

I'm glad to see that free for all's are being curbed, and will not say anything to further to encourage the free for all you perceive.

Thank you for your kind words on me being a valued member, however, I post so seldom, I don't know how I can be valued except maybe by the fact that my member number is so low. (LOL)

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happybirds
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Kim, thanks for the answer. I truly was struggling with the content of the sentance.

You know sometimes things just don't process correctly in your brain even though you read it over and over.

Thanks for explaining it,,,that is what I was hoping it meant, but I kept hearing it wrong in my head.

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Charlie
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Thanks, Jan. Actually, there are so many new members that this conversation should probably be rehashed once in a while so newbies realize that we do have a purpose here. I did not percieve it as a free for all! [Wink]

yafa, I'm glad you have thick skin. Please try to understand that sentiment, however. [Smile]

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